An online journal of thoughts on music, history, current events, and earth-shaking minutiae.
Saturday, September 10, 2005
Join A Cult!
No, I wasn't speaking of Islam. This one makes infinitely more sense and will grant you everlasting peace, enlightenment, and love. At least that's what they claim.
All jocularity aside, here's the solution: the Islamic world has to acknowledge the supremacy of the rule of secular law, the concept of democracy, the equality of women, end the persecution of gays (two gay men were hanged in Iran about three weeks back; I'll be glad to forward the link, complete with pics), scrap shari'a law as the sole and only basis for juris prudence, promote scientific discovery (where the muslim world hasn't had ONE important discovery in over 500 years),and renounce terrorism in all of its forms. Additionally, end the silliness in justifying every act of terrorism on Israel, particularly since this war of civilizations began with the first conquest of Jerusalem in 638, their aggression towards the Byzantine Empire starting in the 8th century and culminating with the subsequent sacking of Constantinople in 1453, now known as "Istanbul". And more than anything else, acknowledge and accept competing religions like Christianity into its borders, particularly in Saudi Arabia, where Christians are still persecuted and crucified. Strange as it is to say, the people (ie: you) who spend so much time promoting equality in all of its forms within America are also the same people who justify, if not condone, the actions of the most violently intolerant religion on the planet. Of course, if you'd like to defend a preternaturally aggressive "religion" which promotes intolerance of women, gays, or anyone who dares worship a different way, much less representative man-made law, feel free. It has become abundantly clear that secular democratic thought and strict orthodox Islam cannot co-exist in the same world. On this day above all others, that has become egregiously apparent. (And contrary to your protests, I think you know that, too.) And before you launch a counter-argument that Christians are guilty of many of the same things over the years, just remember, we're talking about MODERN DAY, not 500 years ago. The difference between the Western World and the Muslim one is that one moved forward that the other moved backwards. Someone's got civilize themselves, and it isn't the Western World. I'm no longer tolerant of those who have no tolerance for us.
Unfortunately, you and others that share your perspective will continue to bang your collective heads against the wall and endanger us all.
Your expressed view that Christianity and the West are inherently superior to Islam, is part and parcell of their problem with us. Thanks to people like you and George Bush, we are in MORE danger not less. There will be more attacks on us and I hold all fanatics responsible.
But hey what do you say to a group that proclaimed MISSION ACCOMPLISHED 1,800 American lives ago?
What do you say to a group that claims to be all about protecting the American people until a hurricane exposes just how unprepared we are?
This is tragic and things are just going to get worse thanks to maniacs, some are Muslims who think they know the "only way" and some are Christians who think they know the "only way". . .
The western world, specifically those that practice secular, representative democracy, which grew out of both Judeo-Christian ethics, the Age of Enlightenment, the Protestant Reformation, and Anglo-Saxon law HAS rendered western civilization superior to any other, including but not exclusive to the muslim world, which is, at minimum, 500 years behind in science, medicine, philosophy, economics, and governance. This is an irrefutable fact. This would be of no consequence were it not for the fact that the Islamic world is both incredulous and disgusted by this fact, and thus they've vowed world-wide "jihad" in response. (Just as they did as early as 638 Anno Domine) Again, you've failed to tackle any one of my points and only resorted back to standard multi-cultural hackery. Hamilton said that, "The sacred rights of mankind are not to be rummaged for among old parchments or musty records. They are written, as with a sunbeam, in the whole volume of human nature, by the hand of the divinity itself; and can never be erased." To disagree with this is for you to de facto admit that the Islamic world, and those that suffer under the weight of the theocratic fascists that rule them, including but not limited to women, gays, and non-muslims, deserve the inhumane treatment they are currently enduring. It is not for the superior civilization to understand the inferior one; it is for the inferior one to understand the superior one. People don't leave the United States to go and live in Saudi Arabia or the like for its opportunities or its freedom. But hundreds of thousands seek to leave the Islamic world's repression for freedom here. When that trend of emigration is reversed, you'll have a bonafide point. But alas, that won't happen anytime soon. Multi-culturalism is as dead as Theo Van Gogh.
Hey thedaywillcome1, first thanks for calling me "a joke" that's a mature and intelligent way to make an argument. Clearly you don't have enough faith in your argument to let it stand on it's own. Joke indeed! You idiot.
Second let me ask you, and I don't expect a response, how many times have you been to the Middle East? How well do you speak Arabic? How many Muslim friends do you have?
Yeah. . . that's what I figured. Go back and read the National Review some more. . . You fool!
Keep the opining to me, I actually know what I'm talking about. . .
Spitfire -- You don't read carefully Spitfire, I wrote, "INHERENTLY superior" which I don't think anyone can say Christianity is. And anyway, the problem is this: IN fighting bin Laden we are fighting an ideology and not a man, a country or even religion. By doing certain things (our unilateral invasion of Iraq, and mind you I wasn't opposed to it, I just wanted to do it differently) we've created a whole mess of new terrorists. We must stop doing things like or the buildings will keep coming down. There's a report that an attack on LA is next and I am afraid. You see today is the anniversary of less than two dozen men bringing down the WTC, attacking DC and bringing down a plane in PA, with nothing more than box cutters. This is a subtle and difficult war that we are fighting, by doing it ham handedly (symptomatic of the same decay of the mind that thedaywillcome1 suffers from that causes him to be so obnoxious when people are engaging in an adult debate) we are simply making things worse. Speaking Arabic and having been to Mid East as many times as I have gives me an insight into the Arab thought process and trust me, things are getting exponentially worse on the Arab Street not better. . .
I love this country more than anything. My parents are immigrants who have acheived the American dream par excellence and we owe it largely to this country. Because of that I want to see this country safe. Right now we are going about it all wrong.
Further, despite styling himself the safer bet, Bush couldn't have handled New Orleans worse. It's a huge flag for terrorists informing them of how ill prepared we are. . .
Four years after 9/11 I remain frightened. Perhaps morseo than ever.
When 60 percent of muslims in GREAT BRITAIN are polled and say that they'd prefer to live under shari'a law IN GREAT BRITAIN, there's a problem. When a muslim imam in Liverpool in GREAT BRITAIN says that he wants stoning for adultery to become part of British law, there's a problem. Never mind the middle east; let's talk about attitudes of muslims in the western world. Does a filmmaker who makes a documentary critical of Islam's treatment of women deserve to get stabbed in the heart by a muslim in AMSTERDAM?!? Does one need to go to the middle east to understand and somehow find these types of behavioral patters and attitudes unacceptable? I think not. The secular, democratic western world has an existential threat to it, both here and in Europe, a threat that has existed and has flaired up for over 1400 years. Far from claiming that the western world has always behaved in a humane manner, one CAN say that the western world is gaining in fairness for all; the United States in particular has been at the vanguard of democratic thought and experimentation for 400 years. Women didn't have the right to vote in this country 'til 1920. Blacks suffered under Jim Crow laws down south 'til the 60's, but no more. Gays at one point were prosecuted under law in certain states until recently, but no more. There's progress in the west, particularly in the United States. Is there any progress or abolition of institutionalized descrimination for non-muslims, gays, women in the muslim world? Well, you've been there, so I'll defer to you on this question, but I think I can accurately predict the answer. What is more disturbing than the way in which the mass of people in the Islamic world are treated is the fact that muslims in the western world want to impose their rules on the western world. It is inconceivable to me that any nation would let in a muslim immigrant that does not accept the laws of the guest nation it is emigrating to. If they want to stick to these draconian, inhumane, medieval laws in their own countries, fine. But to not accept the rule of law in the nation they've emigrated to is unacceptable.
11 comments:
Way to slag the religion of 1 billion people. . . classy. . .
Eh...it was a joke...(kind of).
Oh one of those, not funny and actually offensive kind of jokes huh? Ok. . .
I don't know what to tell you, dude. The Islamic world needs to get right with Christ. Pronto. Eternal damnation awaits all of them if they don't.
If that comment weren't so dementedly pathetic, it would be comical. That kind of thinking is part of the problem, not the solution. . .
All jocularity aside, here's the solution: the Islamic world has to acknowledge the supremacy of the rule of secular law, the concept of democracy, the equality of women, end the persecution of gays (two gay men were hanged in Iran about three weeks back; I'll be glad to forward the link, complete with pics), scrap shari'a law as the sole and only basis for juris prudence, promote scientific discovery (where the muslim world hasn't had ONE important discovery in over 500 years),and renounce terrorism in all of its forms. Additionally, end the silliness in justifying every act of terrorism on Israel, particularly since this war of civilizations began with the first conquest of Jerusalem in 638, their aggression towards the Byzantine Empire starting in the 8th century and culminating with the subsequent sacking of Constantinople in 1453, now known as "Istanbul". And more than anything else, acknowledge and accept competing religions like Christianity into its borders, particularly in Saudi Arabia, where Christians are still persecuted and crucified. Strange as it is to say, the people (ie: you) who spend so much time promoting equality in all of its forms within America are also the same people who justify, if not condone, the actions of the most violently intolerant religion on the planet. Of course, if you'd like to defend a preternaturally aggressive "religion" which promotes intolerance of women, gays, or anyone who dares worship a different way, much less representative man-made law, feel free. It has become abundantly clear that secular democratic thought and strict orthodox Islam cannot co-exist in the same world. On this day above all others, that has become egregiously apparent. (And contrary to your protests, I think you know that, too.) And before you launch a counter-argument that Christians are guilty of many of the same things over the years, just remember, we're talking about MODERN DAY, not 500 years ago. The difference between the Western World and the Muslim one is that one moved forward that the other moved backwards. Someone's got civilize themselves, and it isn't the Western World. I'm no longer tolerant of those who have no tolerance for us.
Unfortunately, you and others that share your perspective will continue to bang your collective heads against the wall and endanger us all.
Your expressed view that Christianity and the West are inherently superior to Islam, is part and parcell of their problem with us. Thanks to people like you and George Bush, we are in MORE danger not less. There will be more attacks on us and I hold all fanatics responsible.
But hey what do you say to a group that proclaimed MISSION ACCOMPLISHED 1,800 American lives ago?
What do you say to a group that claims to be all about protecting the American people until a hurricane exposes just how unprepared we are?
This is tragic and things are just going to get worse thanks to maniacs, some are Muslims who think they know the "only way" and some are Christians who think they know the "only way". . .
So sad. . .
The western world, specifically those that practice secular, representative democracy, which grew out of both Judeo-Christian ethics, the Age of Enlightenment, the Protestant Reformation, and Anglo-Saxon law HAS rendered western civilization superior to any other, including but not exclusive to the muslim world, which is, at minimum, 500 years behind in science, medicine, philosophy, economics, and governance. This is an irrefutable fact. This would be of no consequence were it not for the fact that the Islamic world is both incredulous and disgusted by this fact, and thus they've vowed world-wide "jihad" in response. (Just as they did as early as 638 Anno Domine) Again, you've failed to tackle any one of my points and only resorted back to standard multi-cultural hackery. Hamilton said that, "The sacred rights of mankind are not to be rummaged for among old parchments or musty records. They are written, as with a sunbeam, in the whole volume of human nature, by the hand of the divinity itself; and can never be erased." To disagree with this is for you to de facto admit that the Islamic world, and those that suffer under the weight of the theocratic fascists that rule them, including but not limited to women, gays, and non-muslims, deserve the inhumane treatment they are currently enduring. It is not for the superior civilization to understand the inferior one; it is for the inferior one to understand the superior one. People don't leave the United States to go and live in Saudi Arabia or the like for its opportunities or its freedom. But hundreds of thousands seek to leave the Islamic world's repression for freedom here. When that trend of emigration is reversed, you'll have a bonafide point. But alas, that won't happen anytime soon. Multi-culturalism is as dead as Theo Van Gogh.
Hey thedaywillcome1, first thanks for calling me "a joke" that's a mature and intelligent way to make an argument. Clearly you don't have enough faith in your argument to let it stand on it's own. Joke indeed! You idiot.
Second let me ask you, and I don't expect a response, how many times have you been to the Middle East? How well do you speak Arabic? How many Muslim friends do you have?
Yeah. . . that's what I figured. Go back and read the National Review some more. . . You fool!
Keep the opining to me, I actually know what I'm talking about. . .
Spitfire -- You don't read carefully Spitfire, I wrote, "INHERENTLY superior" which I don't think anyone can say Christianity is. And anyway, the problem is this: IN fighting bin Laden we are fighting an ideology and not a man, a country or even religion. By doing certain things (our unilateral invasion of Iraq, and mind you I wasn't opposed to it, I just wanted to do it differently) we've created a whole mess of new terrorists. We must stop doing things like or the buildings will keep coming down. There's a report that an attack on LA is next and I am afraid. You see today is the anniversary of less than two dozen men bringing down the WTC, attacking DC and bringing down a plane in PA, with nothing more than box cutters. This is a subtle and difficult war that we are fighting, by doing it ham handedly (symptomatic of the same decay of the mind that thedaywillcome1 suffers from that causes him to be so obnoxious when people are engaging in an adult debate) we are simply making things worse. Speaking Arabic and having been to Mid East as many times as I have gives me an insight into the Arab thought process and trust me, things are getting exponentially worse on the Arab Street not better. . .
I love this country more than anything. My parents are immigrants who have acheived the American dream par excellence and we owe it largely to this country. Because of that I want to see this country safe. Right now we are going about it all wrong.
Further, despite styling himself the safer bet, Bush couldn't have handled New Orleans worse. It's a huge flag for terrorists informing them of how ill prepared we are. . .
Four years after 9/11 I remain frightened. Perhaps morseo than ever.
When 60 percent of muslims in GREAT BRITAIN are polled and say that they'd prefer to live under shari'a law IN GREAT BRITAIN, there's a problem. When a muslim imam in Liverpool in GREAT BRITAIN says that he wants stoning for adultery to become part of British law, there's a problem. Never mind the middle east; let's talk about attitudes of muslims in the western world. Does a filmmaker who makes a documentary critical of Islam's treatment of women deserve to get stabbed in the heart by a muslim in AMSTERDAM?!? Does one need to go to the middle east to understand and somehow find these types of behavioral patters and attitudes unacceptable? I think not. The secular, democratic western world has an existential threat to it, both here and in Europe, a threat that has existed and has flaired up for over 1400 years. Far from claiming that the western world has always behaved in a humane manner, one CAN say that the western world is gaining in fairness for all; the United States in particular has been at the vanguard of democratic thought and experimentation for 400 years. Women didn't have the right to vote in this country 'til 1920. Blacks suffered under Jim Crow laws down south 'til the 60's, but no more. Gays at one point were prosecuted under law in certain states until recently, but no more. There's progress in the west, particularly in the United States. Is there any progress or abolition of institutionalized descrimination for non-muslims, gays, women in the muslim world? Well, you've been there, so I'll defer to you on this question, but I think I can accurately predict the answer. What is more disturbing than the way in which the mass of people in the Islamic world are treated is the fact that muslims in the western world want to impose their rules on the western world. It is inconceivable to me that any nation would let in a muslim immigrant that does not accept the laws of the guest nation it is emigrating to. If they want to stick to these draconian, inhumane, medieval laws in their own countries, fine. But to not accept the rule of law in the nation they've emigrated to is unacceptable.
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